 |
 |
 |
 |
| List: MassLep Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2026 18:40:02 +0000 (UTC) From: '<fsmodel...>' via MassLep <masslep...> Subject: Re: [MassLep] Swan Song |
||||
------=_Part_769086_1514801176.1774723202988 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Bill & Joe, That is really interesting! Another interpretation would be that Columbine = DW is not a distinct species. In light of the facts as they stand now, one = must conclude it is not distinguishable from Wild Indigo DW in the field. T= he supposedly diagnostic field marks - dark color, small size, close associ= ation with wild columbine - can be the same. [And the male genitalia,too, a= pparently!]=C2=A0 DNA work is needed, but my suspicion is that it won't resolve the problem. = More likely, it will complicate it further. [The buckeye morass is another = example. I assume you are familiar with Nick Grishin's work, published with= Cong as the senior author.]=C2=A0 The butterflies are simply oblivious to the neat little boxes taxonomists c= reate. It is beginning to look like taxonomy is indeed as much an art as it= is a science. That is probably the only take-home message. Cheers,Frank On Saturday, March 28, 2026 at 07:44:50 AM PDT, Joseph Wicinski <joewiz= <vet...> wrote: =20 Hi Frank,Joe forwarded me your post from Masslep.=C2=A0 Thinking of you an= d all of our good times together, and hoping you are still enjoying what yo= u can.=C2=A0 Hopefully you keep sharing your photos. Your question about Columbine Duskywings is very interesting to me.=C2=A0 J= oe and I have small dark Duskywings breeding on Wild Columbine in our garde= n, every year for at least 10+ years (longer really).=C2=A0 I got very exci= ted when I first saw it happening. I corresponded with Mike Nelson about them and learned some interesting thi= ngs, namely that Wild Indigo Duskywings can use Wild Columbine as a host pl= ant.=C2=A0 Also, pparently the two species are not distinguishable morpholo= gically, even by genitalia!=C2=A0 (I'm putting words in Mike's mouth, so he= can correct me if necessary.) I raised a couple of caterpillars from eggs I watched a female lay on our C= olumbine.=C2=A0 One of the butterflies that emerged (with crumpled wings) I= transferred to Mass Wildlife to be preserved so that future DNA analysis m= ight reveal something. I still wonder and hope that Columbine Duskywings might be breeding in our = garden all these years.=C2=A0 Maybe time will tell. Thinking of you,Bill On Thu, Mar 26, 2026, 16:52 '<fsmodel...>' via MassLep <masslep@googlegr= oups.com> wrote: Greetings, After spending the first 12 years of my retirement in Massachusetts, I have= now spent the next 12 in Southern California, where it's much warmer in th= e winter. I suffered a stroke in June 2025 during/after an aortic valve rep= lacement procedure. This has limited my mobility but I'm still trying, espe= cially wildflowers, which don't fly away. I also post my older photos as Fa= cebook memories, so many of you still hear from me. But it's not=C2=A0 the = same. I would like to use this note to tie up a loose end. On June 29, 2013, I wa= s at Broad Meadowbrook in Worcester and saw a really tiny duskywing - easil= y the smallest one I have ever seen. It was also rather dark. It was likely= just an aberrent Wild Indigo DW but I can't rule out Columbine DW, whose h= ost plant, Wild Columbine, grows in Massachusetts. According to the field g= uides, Columbine DW would be only slightly out of range in Worcester county= , but not by much, its eastern limit being the Hudson River Valley. And=C2= =A0 trust me - it was very dark and very, very small. I got one decent photo before the butterfly disappeared into the woods. It'= s attached. I'd appreciate any and all opinions. I recognize that field mar= ks take one only so far. IDs based on a single photo are invariably tenuous= . Cheers,Frank Model --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= MassLep" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to masslep+<unsubscribe...> To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/masslep/138= <6288389.378942.1774561913384...> --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= MassLep" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to masslep+<unsubscribe...> To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/masslep/CAG= sF2MDg7SwLKK%2B1N7ZRBtOeCMoY70UnY6%<2BAY_oQR9xG3UcTUQ...> =20 --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= MassLep" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to masslep+<unsubscribe...> To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/masslep/198= <2809073.769087.1774723202990...> ------=_Part_769086_1514801176.1774723202988 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <html><head></head><body><div class=3D"ydp16c2ba44yahoo-style-wrap" style= =3D"font-family:arial;font-size:16px;"><div></div> <div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">Bill & Joe,</div><div di= r=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><span style=3D"letter-spacing: -0.02em;"><b= r></span></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><span style=3D"letter= -spacing: -0.02em;">That is really interesting! Another interpretation woul= d be that Columbine DW is not a distinct species. In light of the facts as = they stand now, one must conclude it is not distinguishable from Wild Indig= o DW in the field. The supposedly diagnostic field marks - dark color, smal= l size, close association with wild columbine - can be the same. [And the m= ale genitalia,too, apparently!] </span></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-set= dir=3D"false"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">DNA work is = needed, but my suspicion is that it won't resolve the problem. More likely,= it will complicate it further. [The buckeye morass is another example. I a= ssume you are familiar with Nick Grishin's work, published with Cong as the= senior author.] </div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><br></di= v><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">The butterflies are simply oblivio= us to the neat little boxes taxonomists create. It is beginning to look lik= e taxonomy is indeed as much an art as it is a science. That is probably th= e only take-home message.</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><br><= /div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">Cheers,</div><div dir=3D"ltr" d= ata-setdir=3D"false">Frank</div><div><br></div> =20 </div><div id=3D"ydp25cc4fyahoo_quoted_4869524330" class=3D"ydp25cc= 4fyahoo_quoted"><div class=3D"ydp25cc4fyahoo-style-wrap" style=3D"font-fami= ly:arial;font-size:16px;"> <div style=3D"font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, s= ans-serif;font-size:13px;color:#26282a;"> =20 <div class=3D"ydp25cc4fquoted-text-header"> On Saturday, March 28, 2026 at 07:44:50 AM PDT, Jos= eph Wicinski <<joewizvet...>> wrote: </div> </div><div style=3D"font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica= , Arial, sans-serif;font-size:13px;color:#26282a;border-left: 1px solid #cc= c;padding-left: 8px;margin: 0px 0px 0px 8px" class=3D"ydp25cc4finline_reply= _quote_container" data-split-quote-node=3D"true"> <div><br></div><div><br></div> <div><div id=3D"ydp25cc4fyiv8106881127"><div><div><div><spa= n style=3D"font-size:12.8px;background-color:rgb(245,250,255);">Hi Frank,</= span><div style=3D"font-size:12.8px;background-color:rgb(245,250,255);">Joe= forwarded me your post from Masslep. Thinking of you and all of our = good times together, and hoping you are still enjoying what you can. = Hopefully you keep sharing your photos.</div><div style=3D"font-size:12.8px= ;background-color:rgb(245,250,255);"><br clear=3D"none"></div><div style=3D= "font-size:12.8px;background-color:rgb(245,250,255);">Your question about C= olumbine Duskywings is very interesting to me. Joe and I have small d= ark Duskywings breeding on Wild Columbine in our garden, every year for at = least 10+ years (longer really). I got very excited when I first saw = it happening.</div><div style=3D"font-size:12.8px;background-color:rgb(245,= 250,255);"><br clear=3D"none"></div><div style=3D"font-size:12.8px;backgrou= nd-color:rgb(245,250,255);">I corresponded with Mike Nelson about them and = learned some interesting things, namely that Wild Indigo Duskywings can use= Wild Columbine as a host plant. Also, pparently the two species are = not distinguishable morphologically, even by genitalia! (I'm putting = words in Mike's mouth, so he can correct me if necessary.)</div><div style= =3D"font-size:12.8px;background-color:rgb(245,250,255);"><br clear=3D"none"= ></div><div style=3D"font-size:12.8px;background-color:rgb(245,250,255);">I= raised a couple of caterpillars from eggs I watched a female lay on our Co= lumbine. One of the butterflies that emerged (with crumpled wings) I = transferred to Mass Wildlife to be preserved so that future DNA analysis mi= ght reveal something.</div><div style=3D"font-size:12.8px;background-color:= rgb(245,250,255);"><br clear=3D"none"></div><div style=3D"font-size:12.8px;= background-color:rgb(245,250,255);">I still wonder and hope that Columbine = Duskywings might be breeding in our garden all these years. Maybe tim= e will tell.</div><div style=3D"font-size:12.8px;background-color:rgb(245,2= 50,255);"><br clear=3D"none"></div><div style=3D"font-size:12.8px;backgroun= d-color:rgb(245,250,255);">Thinking of you,</div><div style=3D"font-size:12= .8px;background-color:rgb(245,250,255);">Bill</div><br clear=3D"none"><br c= lear=3D"none"><div id=3D"ydp25cc4fyiv8106881127yqt18035" class=3D"ydp25cc4f= yiv8106881127yqt4518979994"><div class=3D"ydp25cc4fyiv8106881127gmail_quote= ydp25cc4fyiv8106881127gmail_quote_container"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"ydp= 25cc4fyiv8106881127gmail_attr">On Thu, Mar 26, 2026, 16:52 '<a shape=3D"rec= t" href=3D"mailto:<fsmodel...>" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">fsmod= <el...></a>' via MassLep <<a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"mailto:masslep@go= oglegroups.com" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank"><masslep...>= </a>> wrote:<br clear=3D"none"></div><blockquote style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .= 8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;" class=3D"ydp25cc4fyiv8106= 881127gmail_quote"><div><div style=3D"font-family:arial;font-size:16px;"><d= iv dir=3D"ltr">Greetings,</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br clear=3D"none"></div><d= iv dir=3D"ltr">After spending the first 12 years of my retirement in Massac= husetts, I have now spent the next 12 in Southern California, where it's mu= ch warmer in the winter. I suffered a stroke in June 2025 during/after an a= ortic valve replacement procedure. This has limited my mobility but I'm sti= ll trying, especially wildflowers, which don't fly away. I also post my old= er photos as Facebook memories, so many of you still hear from me. But it's= not the same.</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br clear=3D"none"></div><div di= r=3D"ltr">I would like to use this note to tie up a loose end. On June 29, = 2013, I was at Broad Meadowbrook in Worcester and saw a really tiny duskywi= ng - easily the smallest one I have ever seen. It was also rather dark. It = was likely just an aberrent Wild Indigo DW but I can't rule out Columbine D= W, whose host plant, Wild Columbine, grows in Massachusetts. According to t= he field guides, Columbine DW would be only slightly out of range in Worces= ter county, but not by much, its eastern limit being the Hudson River Valle= y. And trust me - it was very dark and very, very small.</div><div di= r=3D"ltr"><br clear=3D"none"></div><div dir=3D"ltr">I got one decent photo = before the butterfly disappeared into the woods. It's attached. I'd appreci= ate any and all opinions. I recognize that field marks take one only so far= . IDs based on a single photo are invariably tenuous.</div><div dir=3D"ltr"= ><br clear=3D"none"></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Cheers,</div><div dir=3D"ltr">Fr= ank Model</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br clear=3D"none"></div></div></div> <p></p> -- <br clear=3D"none"> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= MassLep" group.<br clear=3D"none"> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to <a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"mailto:masslep+<unsubscribe...>= om" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">masslep+<unsubscribe...>= </a>.<br clear=3D"none"> To view this discussion visit <a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"https://groups.goog= le.com/d/msgid/masslep/<1386288389.378942.1774561913384...>?utm= _medium=3Demail&utm_source=3Dfooter" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank"= >https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/masslep/1386288389.378942.1774561913384%= 40mail.yahoo.com</a>.<br clear=3D"none"> </blockquote></div></div></div></div> <p></p> -- <br clear=3D"none"> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= MassLep" group.<br clear=3D"none"> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to <a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"mailto:masslep+<unsubscribe...>= om" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">masslep+<unsubscribe...>= </a>.<br clear=3D"none"> To view this discussion visit <a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"https://groups.goog= le.com/d/msgid/masslep/CAGsF2MDg7SwLKK%2B1N7ZRBtOeCMoY70UnY6%2BAY_oQR9xG3Uc= <TUQ...>?utm_medium=3Demail&utm_source=3Dfooter" rel=3D"nof= ollow" target=3D"_blank">https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/masslep/CAGsF2MD= g7SwLKK%2B1N7ZRBtOeCMoY70UnY6%<2BAY_oQR9xG3UcTUQ...></a>.<br cl= ear=3D"none"> </div></div></div> </div> </div></div></body></html> <p></p> -- <br /> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups &= quot;MassLep" group.<br /> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an e= mail to <a href=3D"mailto:masslep+<unsubscribe...>">masslep+uns= <ubscribe...></a>.<br /> To view this discussion visit <a href=3D"https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/= masslep/<1982809073.769087.1774723202990...>?utm_medium=3Demail= &utm_source=3Dfooter">https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/masslep/1982809073.= <769087.1774723202990...></a>.<br /> ------=_Part_769086_1514801176.1774723202988-- |
||||