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| List: Carolina-Leps Date: Fri, 19 Apr 2024 12:56:59 -0400 From: Harry LeGrand (via carolinaleps Mailing List) <carolinaleps...> Subject: Re: Is a summer brood of Juvenal's Duskywing possible? |
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--000000000000aaf2ce061675fad0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I agree with Salman. The first photo looks like a male Horace's, though just from below. The second is clearly a fresh female Horace's, from above -- the large black patches on the FW. Juvenal's female has dark brown or smaller black blotches. So, as far as we know, Juvenal's in the East is single-brooded. With all of the genetic studies of azures, crescents, satyrs, etc. in recent years, I am still shocked that the Southwestern subspecies -- *Erynnis juvenalis clitus* -- with a strong white HW fringe as well and with a strong second brood in July and August, seemingly has still not been given a full species name and status. It certainly is not a Juvenal's Duskywing, which is single brooded over its range. Harry LeGrand On Fri, Apr 19, 2024 at 12:40=E2=80=AFPM "Abdulali, Salman" <carolinaleps@d= uke.edu> wrote: > According to Burns, about 15% of North Carolina 2nd brood Horace females > have the lower spot, and about 8% have the upper spot. > > See page 301 of =E2=80=9CEvolution of Skipper Butterflies of the genus Er= ynnis=E2=80=9D by > John Burns. > > So these are not that unusual for Horace. > > Salman Abdulali > > Begin forwarded message: > > *From:* Jeff Cagle <carolinaleps...> > *Date:* April 19, 2024 at 11:59:42 AM EDT > *To:* <carolinaleps...> > *Subject:* *Is a summer brood of Juvenal's Duskywing possible?* > *Reply-To:* Jeff Cagle <jeffreyrcagle...> > > =EF=BB=BF > I have now encountered two different Duskywings that present as Juvenal's > by the hindwing "Juvie spots." One shows additional signs of Juvenal's > genetics - gray overscaling in the FW above and very large glassy spots in > a female. > > One observation is from Jul 12 2023 in Chatham Co: > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.inaturalist.org/observations/1725= 16823__;!!OToaGQ!uHOK63s3DFxFbgIcoZBjbZgLcuDLHXB-skSqrH3dPWNGBSpiyedZsUOKGK= fYkIK4-TbPRCERMpAA3EXWCLY95w$=20 > <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.inaturalist.org/observations/172= 516823__;!!OToaGQ!u8-FzERW7n2TRKPJ9AMozNlKkiJe0pazMaEgnY8H1I17sdQ30qSW6_AUB= YboCPuKE0hyyLpOYVFXpQxktmsPdzB1dA$> > The other is from Aug 2022 seemingly near Charlotte (data obscured): > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.inaturalist.org/observations/1308= 15076__;!!OToaGQ!uHOK63s3DFxFbgIcoZBjbZgLcuDLHXB-skSqrH3dPWNGBSpiyedZsUOKGK= fYkIK4-TbPRCERMpAA3EVSPub7kQ$=20 > <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.inaturalist.org/observations/130= 815076__;!!OToaGQ!u8-FzERW7n2TRKPJ9AMozNlKkiJe0pazMaEgnY8H1I17sdQ30qSW6_AUB= YboCPuKE0hyyLpOYVFXpQxktmsXELeSSQ$> > > As I think through hypotheses, I get > > (1) Late-emerging Juvenal's > (2) Horace's with the gene for Juvie spots > (3) Hybrid > > What do y'all think about the relative likelihood of each? On iNat, there > is no attestation of adult Juvenal's in August even as far north as Canada > - except for a ssp down in Mexico. > > Jeff Cagle > > > --000000000000aaf2ce061675fad0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable <div dir=3D"ltr"><div>I agree with Salman.=C2=A0 The first photo looks like= a male Horace's, though just from below.=C2=A0 The second is clearly a= fresh female Horace's, from above -- the large black patches on the FW= .=C2=A0 Juvenal's female has dark brown or smaller black blotches.=C2= =A0 <br></div><div><br></div><div>So, as far as we know, Juvenal's in t= he East is single-brooded.=C2=A0 With all of the genetic studies of azures,= crescents, satyrs, etc. in recent years, I am still shocked that the South= western subspecies -- <i>Erynnis juvenalis clitus</i> -- with a strong whit= e HW fringe as well and with a strong second brood in July and August, seem= ingly has still not been given a full species name and status.=C2=A0 It cer= tainly is not a Juvenal's Duskywing, which is single brooded over its r= ange.</div><div><br></div><div>Harry LeGrand<br></div></div><br><div class= =3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Fri, Apr 19, 2024= at 12:40=E2=80=AFPM "Abdulali, Salman" <<a href=3D"mailto:car= <olinaleps...>"><carolinaleps...></a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquo= te class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px = solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"> <div> According to Burns, about 15% of North Carolina 2nd brood Horace females ha= ve the lower spot, and about 8% have the upper spot. <div><br> </div> <div>See page 301 of =E2=80=9CEvolution of Skipper Butterflies of the genus= Erynnis=E2=80=9D by John Burns.</div> <div><br> </div> <div>So these are not that unusual for Horace.</div> <div><br> </div> <div>Salman Abdulali<br id=3D"m_6879453805696056805lineBreakAtBeginningOfMe= ssage"> <div><br> <blockquote type=3D"cite"> <div>Begin forwarded message:</div> <div> <div style=3D"font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-v= ariant-caps:normal;font-weight:400;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;t= ext-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text= -decoration:none"> <div dir=3D"ltr"><br> </div> <div dir=3D"ltr"><b>From:</b><span>=C2=A0</span>Jeff Cagle <<a href=3D"m= ailto:<carolinaleps...>" target=3D"_blank"><carolinaleps...></a>>= ;<br> <b>Date:</b><span>=C2=A0</span>April 19, 2024 at 11:59:42 AM EDT<br> <b>To:</b><span>=C2=A0</span><a href=3D"mailto:<carolinaleps...>" targe= t=3D"_blank"><carolinaleps...></a><br> <b>Subject:</b><span>=C2=A0</span><b>Is a summer brood of Juvenal's Dus= kywing possible?</b><br> <b>Reply-To:</b><span>=C2=A0</span>Jeff Cagle <<a href=3D"mailto:jeffrey= <rcagle...>" target=3D"_blank"><jeffreyrcagle...></a>><br> <br> </div> <div dir=3D"ltr">=EF=BB=BF <div dir=3D"ltr">I have now encountered two different Duskywings that prese= nt as Juvenal's by the hindwing "Juvie spots."=C2=A0 One show= s additional signs of Juvenal's genetics - gray overscaling in the FW a= bove and very large glassy spots in a female. <div><br> </div> <div>One observation is from Jul 12 2023 in Chatham Co:=C2=A0<a href=3D"htt= ps://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.inaturalist.org/observations/172516823= __;!!OToaGQ!u8-FzERW7n2TRKPJ9AMozNlKkiJe0pazMaEgnY8H1I17sdQ30qSW6_AUBYboCPu= KE0hyyLpOYVFXpQxktmsPdzB1dA$" target=3D"_blank">https://www.inaturalist.org= /observations/172516823</a></div> <div>The other is from Aug 2022 seemingly near Charlotte (data obscured):= =C2=A0<a href=3D"https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.inaturalist.org/ob= servations/130815076__;!!OToaGQ!u8-FzERW7n2TRKPJ9AMozNlKkiJe0pazMaEgnY8H1I1= 7sdQ30qSW6_AUBYboCPuKE0hyyLpOYVFXpQxktmsXELeSSQ$" target=3D"_blank">https:/= /www.inaturalist.org/observations/130815076</a></div> <div><br> </div> <div>As I think through hypotheses, I get</div> <div><br> </div> <div>(1) Late-emerging Juvenal's</div> <div>(2) Horace's with the gene for Juvie spots</div> <div>(3) Hybrid</div> <div><br> What do y'all think about the relative likelihood of each?=C2=A0 On iNa= t, there is no attestation of adult Juvenal's in August even as far nor= th as Canada - except for a ssp down in Mexico.<br> <br> Jeff Cagle</div> </div> </div> </div> </div> </blockquote> </div> <br> </div> </div> </blockquote></div> --000000000000aaf2ce061675fad0-- |
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